Swingers Club, Heteronormativity, & Couple Privilege… and DVP

J and I had a fabulous time at our swingers’ club last night (hooray for Hump Day!)

But, almost every time we’re there I become at least mildly irritated by displays of heternormativity. And now I can include becoming annoyed by the system of couple privilege at play. 

Last night, one of our closest friends met us there (it was his “singles” night and his wife, another super close and awesome friend of ours, was at home with their baby). It was really fun to hang out together, but I was completely flabbergasted when the staff came into the Couples Lounge to tell us that the three of us could not be in there together. Typically, only hetero couples and single women are allowed in the Couples Lounge, and it didn’t cross my mind that having another guy with J and I would be a problem. It was a dual heteronormativity/couple privilege situation, and it really did leave my mind blown. The staff member who told us to leave said that having another guy with us was only allowed on their themed “Bi Night”- wtf? It’s always “bi night” there if you are a woman, but apparently men only get one night a month, and on that special night (whoopdedoo) if you are a man and don’t have a woman half, you are allowed into the Couples Lounge. Big deal. And- this idea assumes that men who want to go into the Couples Lounge are bi to begin with (and I still can’t figure out why the Couples Lounge is the place where you would extend monthly privileges to bi men, instead of it always being a welcoming space). Last night, it was a situation of three people who simply wanted to be around each other in one of the club spaces. And what about people in poly configurations, like triads? Can they not then enjoy the Couples Lounge? Perhaps they could get in without notice if they were a man-woman-woman triad, but a man-man-woman triad would, based on our experience last night, would run into some difficulties. That’s an issue.

Now that I have gotten my little rantiness out of the way, I have to say that I checked another super fun and exploratory thing off my sexy list- DVP! (double vaginal penetration).

I. loved. it.

Big surprise, haha! Given my love of multiple cocks, I had a feeling that I would dig it, and I did. And, it was surprisingly easy, logistically. I was riding our friend, and J came behind me in doggy style position. I think my pussy has perhaps gotten used to fairly wide insertions, with all of the play J and I do with his cock sheaths. It felt amazingly good!!! After J came, it was so hot to have J’s come sliding around another cock inside me. Mmm, delicious.

Awesome Threesome Experiences

My 5 Hottest Threesome Experiences” is live on DatingAdvice.com today :) I love this post! So many positive memories, experiences, fantasies, situations to look forward to… And don’t forget about my #Threesome #Advanced post I published a couple of weeks ago! (Because that most definitely counts among my hottest threesome experiences)

Threesomes & Moresomes

My next article for DA went live today: “The Secrets to Having a Good Threesome

Here’s an excerpt:

“Key factors to consider and questions to answer:

  • Who is OK to invite for group sex (friends, strangers, etc.)?
  • How will group sex impact the relationship among the people involved?
  • Is it OK if it happens again?
  • What are the sexual and emotional boundaries?
  • Can you manage jealousy, competitiveness and possessiveness to the extent that a threesome/moresome will be a fun and positive experience?
  • What are your safer sex practices for a group sex encounter?
  • What is the goal of the group sex encounter (fun, experimentation, closeness, love, etc.)?”

Check it out! :)

My next one for them will be on how to find people for group sex. Hot!

Starting the Open Conversation

My next post on DatingAdvice.com went live today: “How Do I Talk to My Partner if I Want to Open Up Our Relationship?

This was one was a bit more difficult for me to write, because J and I didn’t have to go through that conversation; we arrived at ethical nonmonogamy together after reading Sex at Dawn. I haven’t been on either side of that conversation before, and so my advice came from the books I have read and talking to friends who have experienced that process. 

Coincidentally, DA also published an article today called “How To Get the Threesome You’ve Always Wanted.” I have been working on a Threesomes & Moresomes post for DA, and so I was pretty intrigued what this guy had to say (a self-described social dynamics expert and coach… uh huh). There are things he included that seemed insightful- a threesome can include another guy and it’s not necessarily gay, threesomes aren’t just like porn (they can be boring or awkward or stressful), and threesomes can manifest in a few different ways (you’re part of a couple and adding a third, you find a couple of friends or strangers and get it on, or your a third to an existing couple). Other than that, everything else he wrote makes me think he has no experience with threesomes. Or at the very least, he over simplified a lot. And these two pieces of “advice” are absolutely terrible: 

“Asking your girl might be the most direct way to get a threesome, but it’s also just about the worst way to get it.”

You and your girl grab a third wheel.
This is how most people who are actively aspiring to a threesome are able to make it happen.
However, there’s a problem with this. On a certain level, you’re basically telling your girlfriend she isn’t enough for you and you aren’t that interested in her feelings.”


Hopefully my post will even out some of the twisted things he wrote. My next post going live for DA will be on managing jealousy, and then my threesomes and moresomes post :)

Single Male Swingers

I am a good looking, single, fit, down to earth guy that wants to be more involved in the swinging lifestyle. I find it hard as a single male though. Can you give me any advice? 

I can try! As a partnered female, I definitely have a different experience in the swinging community than a single male (most likely) does. Here are my thoughts:

Put yourself out there: Use lifestyle sites (examples: SwingLifestyle, Lifestyle Lounge, Lust Lab, Kasidie; there are tons of sites, and many of them geography-specific), Craigslist, and other online resources that you are comfortable with. Use the profile to demonstrate your intelligence, sense of humor, charm, sense of adventure, desires, and fantasies. Post pictures that truly represent yourself (remember, you will meet people eventually and you don’t want to have posted photos from a decade ago). Show up to in-person events if you have them in your area (clubs, parties, and other social gatherings). This is an especially great way to get to know people in your local swing community. If you live in a small area, take advantage of the community online to begin exploring and meeting other swingers. Cultivate your social skills, which leads to…

Respect relationships, boundaries, and rules: Respect the couple’s relationship. You are not there to “replace” the male partner, make up for any of his inadequacies, or break them up; quite the opposite. Communicate with potential playmates about their rule and boundaries. These could include sexual boundaries like no kissing, no penetration, or recent STI testing. These could also include relationship boundaries like no phone calls or dates. Or they might include logistical boundaries like play dates only happen at parties or clubs, or only every other Friday. It is important to know what you are getting yourself into so that you can make an informed choice as to whether you will be satisfied (sexually, emotionally, etc.) interacting with potential partners.
This also includes other common points of etiquette, like:
-Always ask before touching, and
-”No” means “no”

Expand your sense of sexual intelligence & sex positivity: This means learning about and keeping an open mind about different sexual behaviors, expressions, acts, and different erotic activities. You don’t have to be into them (or even understand them), but it is important to stay open-minded. This is especially important when you are mingling within a sexually open and adventurous crowd. Also, swinging is a pretty heteronormative space (for males); that is, while female bisexuality is highly encouraged and admired, men are not given the same space to explore same sex sexual activity. (I think this is my single biggest gripe with swinger spaces. What the hell is so threatening about men exploring their sexuality? I know so many women that find it incredibly hot. I think men police each other, à la internalized homophobia. Just my little bit of ranting and theorizing.) Even though (male) heteronormativity is the norm, I would highly encourage you to examine your own comfort levels and desires around same sex interactions. I would encourage you to reach a space where you are truly comfortable being naked around other naked men (who wants to be uncomfortable in a group sex scenario, especially if you are intentionally putting yourself in those situations?). What I am really trying to say is: homophobic attitudes are not cool. Don’t be homophobic, even if you don’t want to engage in any kind of sexual activity with another guy. Be an ally, and be open to the fact that some men are heteroflexible (will play with other men if it’s right and fun for them), some are bisexual to varying degrees, and some are gay. Be respectful. Respect is sexy.

Become familiar with MFMs, gangbangs, and hotwifing: These are common configurations when couples add in single males. MFMs are threesomes with two men. Gangbangs are single female-multiple male encounters. Hotwifing may involved the women’s male partner present or not, but regardless of his presence, you should remember that hotwifing implicitly involve a hot husband. Generally speaking (but not always), these configurations involve you being naked with other men around, who are often naked themselves. Also, it may be interesting for you to read up a little on sperm competition so that you can understand some of the possible reasoning behind why multiple male encounters can be such a huge turn-on for men. I know a couple of single men who truly, genuinely enjoy being the third to a couple in sexual encounters; they are turned on most by experiences with couples, and thus have a lot of success in having hot encounters. They are able to explain their desires clearly and genuinely, and have ideas themselves about positions, behaviors, and activities that they want to try with a couple. There is definitely a difference between a guy that just wants to get laid and will settle for playing with a couple so he can have sex with a girl, and a guy that actually enjoys the group sex dynamic that playing with a couple (or a group) creates.

Remember you are a whole person and deserve to be treated with respect: Traditional swingers tend to focus on sexual encounters and shy away from emotional intimacy. “Progressive swingers” tend to desire some level of friendship to accompany sexual intimacy. Think about what sounds best to you, and experiment with different encounters to find the right mix of sexual and emotional intimacy for you. It is important to remember that many partnered (traditional) swingers find that swinging kicks their partnered sex life into overdrive, and so other partners they have may fulfill fantasies or desires. This can, I think, be a double-edged sword: you may find it very hot to be the single person that adds some serious heat to a couple’s sex life, and you may also feel somewhat discarded after the encounter is over. I think it is really important to know why you want to be involved in the very couple-centric swinging community, so that you are emotionally and/or mentally guarded against unintentional hurt. And remember that regardless of the situation, you deserve to ask for a sexually satisfying experience and be treated with respect.

Does anyone else have any good pointers for single men in the swinging community?

Double Impact Commercial

This commercial is so hilarious (thank goodness J saw it at the gym; we’re not exposed to stupid commercials any other place). It’s so awesome to me that MFMs are gaining more mainstream representation (as opposed to FMFs). You know, sometimes a woman really wants two men at once. 

Liquid-Plumr Double Impact Commercial

MFM- The Good and The Bad

K and I have continually been working to figure out exactly what it is that we want out of this “lifestyle” ever since we got into it.  We continually discuss our ideas about what we would like to see happen, what works for us, what we have had the most fun with, and what we would still like to try. 

Recently K decided that she would really like to try an MFM so we asked a friend of ours from a couple that we play regularly with to join us.  He, after some conversations with his own partner, agreed to try out the situation with us.  Because I (J) am not bisexual this meant that all of the focus would be on K; a situation that K thought sounded absolutely perfect!  Before getting in to this sort of “lifestyle” the idea of an MFM threesome was not a turn-on for me at all but after talking with K and hearing how excited she was about this sort of scenario, I was completely turned-on!  It helped me to realize that I get really turned on when K is really turned on (something that I had already suspected); so even though an MFM really doesn’t do anything for me personally. . .I was completely on-board with the idea because K was so excited about it!

So K and I had an MFM with this friend from another couple we play with frequently and the experience was awesome.  He is a really great guy and very respectful and polite; the three of us have a pretty good friendship and K has an especially good connection with him.  The experience was awesome and I was able to explore a whole new aspect of stuff that turns K on that I had never known about before!  (I am thinking here about the fact that K loves giving and receiving pleasure at the same time with two different men!) Overall the experience was really great because everyone got what they wanted; K got to have twice as much attention on her, J got to see K completely turned-on, and our friend got to be an integral part of making a sexual experience an awesome sexual experience for everyone involved! (Thanks J!)

While that MFM was a great experience, not all of them go so well. . .

After that MFM (and drawing on her experience and everything we have learned up to this point) K decided that what she really wanted was to meet some men that she thought were attractive and have primarily sexual relationships with them.  She is not comfortable meeting men alone (and we have a rule that before we play separately, we need to meet one another’s partners) so we decided to post an MFM ad on Craigslist and be very specific about what we were looking for.  The ad required people to write in complete sentences, use paragraphs and punctuation, come across as intelligent, and generally seem appealing.  Despite these requirements. . . most people (50+) failed miserably.  However, among the crowd there were a few standouts.

We went last night to a local microbrewery to meet with one of the standouts.  He was very polite and we had a good time chatting with him while we ate.  Despite his generally nice demeanor, he still had some characteristics that were a bit of a turn-off such as seeming a bit arrogant and not being willing to express a whole lot of emotion (smiling, laughing, etc).  When he walked away to use the restroom K and I had a rushed conversation about what we should do.  K really wanted my opinion about how to proceed but it was difficult for me to give advice in a situation that was primarily about her pleasure, not mine. After our discussion K decided that she wanted to invite him over and go through with the “MFM.”  I suggested that we merely invite him over to hang out and if it led to more, we could cross that bridge when we came to it.

So K invited him over and we watched some of our favorite television shows while chatting with him.  After about 20 minutes of hanging out, I remembered that I had told some friends that I would be online that evening to chat so I told K that I was going to sit at the table for a little bit and chat with them.   During the time that I was chatting with friends online, K asked me a few times if I wanted to do it (while she made out with this M) and I responded that I was still chatting with our friends online.  After about 10 minutes K and (the other M) got up and told me that they were going into the bedroom and that I should come in as soon as I was done chatting.

This was a huge turn-off for me.  I felt like I went from being the MF inviting an additional M to being the M invited to join an MF.  I was very put off by the situation so I stayed at my computer and continued to email people because I was not feeling up for joining in on that situation.  K came out to get me after about 15 minutes, which was exactly what I needed in order to not feel left out and I proceeded to join in on the fun.  As soon as I got in the room I was confronted with another issue that we have not yet come across since being involved in “group play” situations. . . the other M was particularly well-endowed (like a horse).

I have never before felt insecure about that aspect of my body but coming into this situation, I felt particularly bothered.  I was not immediately bothered by the situation but I did lose my confidence for a minute and felt unsure if I would be able to perform.  Most of the issues around this particular M’s “equipment” came up the next day when I talked to K about the situation.

K has often told me when I ask her about this aspect of our playmates, “I didn’t notice anything different.  They seem like they are pretty much the same size as you.”  Her response in this case was not the same at all; she merely looked flustered and embarrassed and said, “Well, it didn’t work for me.”  For some reason, this response only frustrated me more, it didn’t feel honest when she said it because it just seemed like an attempt to make sure that I would not feel insecure about the situation.  We continued to discuss this aspect of the evening throughout the day and it just seemed to get worse the more we discussed it. 

I just want to pause here and say, “Yes, I realize that it is completely irrational to feel like someone is going to be more satisfying just because they have a horse penis instead of a human penis.  Yes, I know about the studies of woman who are partnered with men who have micro-penises (less than 3”) actually report being more satisfied than woman partnered with average to well-endowed men.  Yes, I understand that it may be uncomfortable to have something that is particularly large going inside of that space.  YES, I get it all!”  OK, now back to the post.

As we were talking about it K made the comment that she could only handle sex of that intensity so often because it is just so intense. This comment only served to irritate me because I want her to describe sex with me as intense, not with some random M.  Apparently this was just a misinterpretation on my part because she meant “intense” as in. . . not good.

Anyway, that was only one issue that we ran into throughout the night.  Since K covered the other issues pretty well in her post, the only other issue that I am going to discuss is the blunders that I think this particular M made.

1) This M was attempting to have an MF scenario but settled for an MFM.  It was particularly stupid of K and I to allow this M to join us after learning that he was primarily looking for NSA (no strings attached) sex but settled for MFMs because it was easier to find NSA sex in that sort of scenario.  When we learned this about him I was immediately turned off because I thought that this may lead to trouble but K was not bothered by this aspect at all so I let it slide.  Looking back on this, it was a mistake to not point this out to K.  The situation would have been greatly improved if we had merely excused ourselves at that point in the evening.

2) This M did not offer to buy his own drinks at dinner.  It was annoying that he did not even reach for his wallet when the bill came.  Enough said.

3) This M almost left our house that evening without even saying goodnight to me.  I had gone to use the restroom (gone 60 seconds at most) and when I came out he was just about out of the door.  I didn’t think too much of it at the time but this really bothered K and it meant a lot to me that it bothered her even when I didn’t think much of it.  I think this final blunder was really the biggest mistake this guy make.  It merely confirmed that this guy merely wanted NSA sex in an MF scenario but that he had to settle for an MFM.  Not even saying goodnight to me or that it was nice to meet me was rude and inappropriate and it was probably the main reason we will never see this person again (oh yah, and his horse penis. . . just kidding :-) )

So, while the MFM can be awesome with the right people, it can also be a major disaster.  Haha, that sounds so obvious when I put it into writing because it is just like everything else in life.  So, this most recent MFM was not great but I am looking forward to another MFM in the future when everyone is excited and respectful and K can have twice the attention and action!

Casual V. Intimate Sex, Religion, Slut-Shaming, and the Madonna-Whore Complex, Oh My!

So J and I experimented having a second guy join in on our sexual fun for the second time… this person brought up some very interesting things for both of us. Is casual sex okay? Does wanting, and liking, casual sex make me a slut? Do I have to really like the guy to do this? Can it just be for fun? What about his intentions, his motivations? What about the psychology behind everyone’s experiences? What role does religion and faith play into our decisions and motivations about sex? Have you heard of the Madonna-Whore Complex? Believe it or not, all of these things go together, and were brought up by inviting one other person into the mix!

Casual versus Intimate Sex: Both J and I agree that we were taught by our families, religious educations, and society that we should only have sex if we deeply care and love the other person. Sex can thus only occur after a deep emotional connection has been created.

I (K) don’t think this is necessarily a “bad” idea. I have learned over the past couple of months that the emotional connection is extremely important to me; I don’t think I would enjoy having a sexual encounter with someone I completely did not know. I think sex is enhanced through knowing my partner; I feel more comfortable being myself, and it is overall more meaningful for me. Having a one-night stand with a complete stranger is not something I am looking for.

However, the black-and-white teaching that love equals sex, and sex equals love, does not hold up for me. I am not completely opposed to having a sexual encounter with someone I don’t know as well, and then experiencing what this is like without having to have any kind of relationship with that person afterwards. I also don’t think that I need to love my partner to have an enjoyable time.

My sexual experiences are completely different with my primary partner (J), because I know it can be romantic and deeply emotional. I appreciate these experiences, and they are truly my favorite experiences. However, I can appreciate the less deep connections and moments with other partners.

I have talked with some friends and family, and some people have expressed concerns to me that women form emotional connections with their sexual partners, and so having casual encounters would be too difficult emotionally. I can definitely see where this concern comes from, and I am cautious about this myself; I feel like I care for people very easily, regardless of any sexual experience I have had with them. J and I have talked about our comfort levels with forming emotional relationships with our other partners, and we are both fairly comfortable with this. It seems a little unnatural to us to not care at some level for our partners, and we both agree that intimacy is enhanced by some level of caring.

The bottom line about this for me is that love does not have to equal sex, and sex does not have to equal love. Sometimes sex is just for fun and excitement, and sometimes we can love others who we do not experience sexual intimacy with. Our most recent MFM highlighted this distinction to me: I can have fun sex without any emotional connections. I can watch this guy leave the house and honestly be happy to never see him again. Yes, the sexual experience probably would have been more fun and exciting and comfortable had I known him a bit better. But it was good enough. And we can move on with getting to know other people!

Slut-Shaming: This is an extremely interesting topic to me (K). I feel like girls and women are socialized to bash on other girls and women, and to compete with each other for potential partners. I feel like this socialization is personally mediated (interpersonal slut-shaming) and internalized (negative self-talk and self-slut shaming). I have recently experienced this, and I remember feeling this growing up.

The idea of slut-shaming is discussed in more detail in The Ethical Slut; it is basically the idea that promiscuous individuals, and more specifically promiscuous women, are immoral and deviant. Sluts cannot be trusted with having honest relationships, they will “steal” your partner behind your back, and they might actually like sex (which, as everyone knows, is in itself wrong. Ha!).

Trying out this idea of casual sex really hammered home this idea of “slutty-ness” for  me.In the Ethical Slut, the authors describe their attempt to reclaim the label slut, as someone who is honest and open about their sexuality, who knows what they want and are not afraid to find it and get it. Am I a slut? Would I call myself a slut? This word just carries a lot of negative connotations; I think I am more comfortable saying I am in an open relationship. Yes, if “slut” meant that I was simply open with my sexuality with others, and that was a good thing because I am honest with myself and others, then I would identify as a “slut.” I went through a whole self-slut shaming process today with J: I didn’t know this guy from last night! He was sort of a jerk! I don’t really want to see him again! I am a big ‘ol SLUT!! He was like, yeah, you are! Huh… okay, well… okay!

I don’t want to feel bad about my sexuality, my sex drive, my experience as a sexual human being. Everyone is sexual. Everyone wants sex. Everyone should be able to enjoy sex. Just because I didn’t know this guy well doesn’t mean I am immoral or bad or weird or gross. I knew what I wanted last night (an MFM!!), and I got it!

Religion and Faith: I grew up in a very progressive religious community, and I had a very comprehensive sexuality education because of it. J’s religious upbringing was a bit more traditional or conservative, but not much more so than mine. We both find it fascinating the guilt and shame that so many Western religions bring to the table when teaching about our bodies, sex, and pleasure.

The guy we met last night ascribes to conservative Christianity. The sense that we got from him was that: 1. If he was in a relationship with someone (aka, not single), he probably would not be trolling Craigslist and hitting up couples; 2. It is okay for him to join a couple, because both partners in the couple agrees to the scenario; 3. However, what these couples are doing (including us) is immoral in the eyes of God, but he is exempt because it’s not his relationship and morals he is screwing up. Interesting, right? He didn’t explicitly say those things, but talked in a round-about way to describe how his religious ideals match up with his behavior.
Madonna-Whore Complex: The Madonna-Whore Complex is the idea that a man experiences sex differently with his wife versus with his “whore.” With this guy last night, I was definitely the “whore” (or slut!). He can join couples and he can find open people online because sex with “whores” is different than sex with one’s “pure and moral wife.” This of course ties in with the influence of religion on one’s views about sexuality. Google the Madonna-Whore Complex- it’s pretty interesting!

Quick tangent: “There are many other reasons for a man’s sex drive to decrease including disease, injury, hormonal changes, stress, and extramarital affairs.” This was a quote we found when researching the Madonna-Whore Complex. What the heck?? Extramarital affairs decrease a man’s sex drive? We beg to differ! We have had more sex together than ever because of all of our experimenting, slutty behavior, and meeting and playing with new people! We think you should be worried if your partner all of a sudden wants sex all the time! :-)